When is drinking a problem?

[Noctavia]

Hi!

I believe my husband has a drinking problem, but he believes there is no problem, as we live in a drinking culture and his friends are right there with him.

I have spoken to our doctor about it and she called him a functional alcoholic. I told my husband about my suspicion and our doctor's opinion about it. The result of that conversation was that I have to bring him proof that his drinking is excessive. I am not allowed to take our doctor's advice, as he believes she is too conservative, and I am not allowed to get anything online.

So herewith my question: Is there someone I can get into contact with or any regulation or guideline that is not an internet article that defines the levels of drinking from acceptable to devastating?

I would really appreciate your help.

Thank you!

[avaneesh912]

Unfortunately even if there is, you can't convince anyone that is deeply entrenched in the disease. You can probably find serenity for yourself by visiting al-anon. My family after almost 14 years realized there are some isms of their own are finding those meetings very useful.

[MyNameIsBetsy]

Hello Noctavia, You're in a difficult situation. Trying to convince someone you love that he has a drinking problem - when he doesn't want to see it - is an emotionally exhausting task.

Here is a list of questions Alcoholics Anonymous uses to begin the discussion. https://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/is-aa-fo ... can-answer

Answering honestly, the results will only reveal if someone is "in trouble" with alcohol. Your husband must come to his own conclusions. Recovery can only begin when we alcoholics honestly and deeply understand we have a problem, and become willing to do something about it.

Good luck to you. Countless of us have walked where you now walk. You are not alone. You might find your own serenity in our sister fellowship, Alanon.

Betsy

[Brock]

It is unfortunate but true, for every piece of evidence put in front of an alcoholic who does not want to stop drinking, he will find an excuse, a reason why the evidence is ‘wrong.’

Our own literature gives examples of alcoholism, mainly the fact that an alcoholic can not have just one or two drinks like other people, once he starts he has to keep going. Perhaps literature like this might help convince him. There is one leaflet I will put a link to, it asks questions and you check your score at the end. You can ask him to do this ‘test,’ if he says it’s internet stuff, then he is just looking for excuses not to try it.

Really I admire your will to help him, but I am afraid many, my wife included, tried hard with their own husbands. It’s heartbreaking to watch someone slide further down the alcoholic drain, but until the alcoholic themselves realizes the position they are in, there is little chance they will surrender to the hopelessness of alcoholism, and surrender they must, that is our first step.

(I see Betsy has put up the same test I was speaking about, so you have the link).

[PaigeB]

The member talks to the newcomer not in a spirit of power but in a spirit of humility and weakness.
ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS COMES OF AGE, p. 279

Oh I have such belligerence come out of my mouth when my family tried to talk to me about my drinking. No matter how much I loved them, I could show NO weakness - because I was protecting my drinking - my RIGHT to drink. My brother talked to me as an alcoholic, yet he still had some of his hackles up because our mom (in Al Anon) had asked him and he knew I had hurt her in some way. He did take me to an open meeting once, but I picked up on the arrogance and desire for power and could only think to fight them. I did not think they knew what I was going through. Drinking was "all I had" and they were hell bent on taking it away from me. Nothing they ever said or did made it easier for me to go to an AA meeting and stick around.

I did finally make it to AA after I met my bottom alone in the darkness of my living room. I turned off the TV and the lights and decided to have "just one more". Somewhere in that "rational" thought my disease intervened - even though no one was there to care or complain... I grabbed 2 beers and opened them both. I took them back to my chair and really KNEW for the first time ever - I knew in my heart of hearts ~ I was a slave to alcohol. I knew AA was my only hope.

That was many days of sobriety ago. Now I struggle with my son who is belligerent when I try to talk to him about alcoholism. He insists that the only way he will go is if I take him, (I have before) is if his girlfriend will quit, if if if. Then blame blame blame. He has not met his bottom yet it seems. All the while we try to deal with his sickness the best way we can in any given moment. I am ever prayerful that his HP has "got him" and that mine has me. That in ways that I do not know and cannot understand his last drink has not yet come.

Those at AA will know the story from a perspective that is understandable to the problem drinker.

Is there someone I can get into contact with or any regulation or guideline that is not an internet article that defines the levels of drinking from acceptable to devastating?

You can find people here:
Find an Open Meeting near you https://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/find-aa-resources
Or go alone if you must - try Alanon https://al-anon.org/

[Indianapolis]

I'll be slightly more frank -- you're asking the wrong people here, if you're looking for support.

Speaking from personal experience, lots of people told me I needed to quit. I told them they were wrong. They diagnosed me as "alcohol use disorder - mild, medium, then severe". I laughed and said I had it under control. I took online tests, which said I drank infinitely more than average, but I compared myself to the drunk laying in the street and said "I'm clearly not an alcoholic -- he is." Even when my finances started crumbling and I shook if I was under a .05 and I had to drink before important meetings so I'd look sober (seriously, that's a thing), I thought I could control it. Years of running my head into that wall, over and over and over.

When is drinking a problem? For me, never! I haven't had a problem with alcohol since the last time I took a drink, which is almost 6 months ago.

And the problem was always "me." Alcohol was a symptom.

No one can diagnose someone else as an alcoholic. And I know, from my own experience, that my life had to become fully unmanageable before I realized that I was the problem and I needed help. My wife telling me I was drinking too much? No chance that swayed me, even an iota. My employers telling me they smelled it? Yawn. Lots of people come into meetings with "back problems" -- wife on their back, law on their back, employer on their back. I've never heard of someone getting long term sobriety because of "back problems," without a personal realization and revelation.

Until I saw for myself, by myself, that I couldn't live that way, I couldn't get help. Good luck. Al-Anon is an awesome group.

[Noctavia]

Thank you very much for your replies.
I was hoping there is a rule that goes something along the line of 3 drinks a day are OK but 10 not... I feel silly now for expecting that. Life is not black and white, is it?

I have looked at the link, thank you for sharing. I don't have the guts to ask him to do it right now, but I'll save it for when I feel a bit stronger.

Have a blessed day!

[tomsteve]

my drinking wasnt a problem for me until i said it was a problem. others may have found my drinking to be a problem for them but that wasnt my problem.

[Noctavia]

I'll have a look at al-anon. Thank you for the reference.

And thank you for the bold and frank answers. I just don't know how to sit by and not do anything while waiting for his world to fall apart. And mine with it...

You made something clear to me: that it really does not matter what I do. This is something I have no influence over. I am just not sure what I am to do with that knowledge...

Thank you again. And I wish you all courage on your paths.

[PaigeB]

Thank you very much for your replies.
I was hoping there is a rule that goes something along the line of 3 drinks a day are OK but 10 not... I feel silly now for expecting that. Life is not black and white, is it?

on page xxvi that "the action of alcohol on an alcoholic is a manifestation of an allergy; that the phenomenon of craving is LIMITED to this class and NEVER occurs in the average temperate drinker." (A phenomenon is something that you can see but can't explain). "These allergic types can NEVER safely use alcohol in ANY FORM AT ALL".

and page 22 I think

We are equally positive that once he takes any alcohol whatever into his system, something happens, both in the bodily and mental sense, which makes it virtually impossible for him to stop. The experience of any alcoholic will abundantly confirm this.

I know that my rule was that if I drank ONE I would find a way to pass out drinking. I never knew where or how I would end up. Most times it was normal & I would be home with a hangover. Sometimes it was a jail or a hospital. A few times I woke up in a strange house on the floor or in a bed trying to think of where I was & who I was last with. This took me to many different cities, all but forgotten by me ~ except the terror of trying to get home.

[Indianapolis]

I just don't know how to sit by and not do anything while waiting for his world to fall apart. And mine with it...

You made something clear to me: that it really does not matter what I do. This is something I have no influence over. I am just not sure what I am to do with that knowledge...

Man, I wish I knew the answers to these questions. I suspect that we all have friends and family who need help. I'd love to get my wife in the program. But for whatever I know about how I got sober, I have no idea how to get someone else there. Despite my seemingly tough comments above, I genuinely empathize -- I am truly there with you in a sense -- and I wish you the best.

[tomsteve]

I'll have a look at al-anon. Thank you for the reference.

I just don't know how to sit by and not do anything while waiting for his world to fall apart. And mine with it...

You made something clear to me: that it really does not matter what I do. This is something I have no influence over. I am just not sure what I am to do with that knowledge...

Thank you again. And I wish you all courage on your paths.

you dont have to sit by and do nothing. something alanon will help you learn is how to set boundaries and consequences for the alcoholic in your life.
alanon will help YOU with much more than that,too.

[Griffindor]

When someone drinks too much.

[cpr123]

Have him try the two drinks and quit test. It may wake him up.
I have heard of people saying they could drink just two a night for a month and never get past the first day. Experience is our best teacher, but if he is like me, he can still explain away experience.

This is what our literature says...

We do not like to pronounce any individual as alcoholic, but you can quickly diagnose yourself. Step over to the nearest barroom and try some controlled drinking. Try to drink and stop abruptly. Try it more than once. It will not take long for you to decide, if you are honest with yourself about it. It may be worth a bad case of jitters if you get a full knowledge of your condition.

[cpr123]

I just realized this is a 2 year old post. oops