11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

The book Alcoholics Anonymous, aka The Big Book, is the basic text for the AA program of sobriety. "Alcoholics Anonymous" Copyright 2012 AAWS, Inc. All Rights, Reserved. Short excerpts used by permission of AAWS
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Karl R
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11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Karl R » Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:43 am

Good Morning,

"HP thank you this morning for your care and concern for me"

Yesterday's reading examined step 10 and the step 10 promises.

Today's reading, below in red, tells us not to rest on our laurels. There have been times during this process that I have wanted to sit back and enjoy the view. To name a few--the fourth column of my 4th step, and some of my amends. The view was nice when I wasn't drinking. I found that if I stopped the ongoing work on my spiritual program of action that I started to become more irritable and just not right with the world. The only solution I found to that was "more action". The daily reprieve concept is true in my life. This business of carrying the vision of God's will into all of our activities is what life is about. I'm lucky to have the 10th step to keep me focused on asking my HP "what's next" for today.

Anyone care to share their ES and H of the influence of the 10th step in their daily life and the life of those around them? Or...the "vital sixth sense"? Or...anything else related?

have a great day and thanks all for being here today,
Karl


It is easy to let up on the spiritual program of action and rest on our laurels. We are headed for trouble if we do, for alcohol is a subtle foe. We are not cured of alcoholism. What we really have is a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition. Every day is a day when we must carry the vision of God's will into all of our activities. "How can I best serve Thee - Thy will (not mine) be done." These are thoughts which must go with us constantly. We can exercise our will power along this line all we wish. It is the proper use of the will.
Much has already been said about receiving strength, inspiration, and direction from Him who has all knowledge and power. If we have carefully followed directions, we have begun to sense the flow of His Spirit into us. To some extent we have become God-conscious. We have begun to develop this vital sixth sense. But we must go further and that means more action.
Last edited by Karl R on Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by martin08 » Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:21 am

The 'vital sixth sense' or, what I surmise is a reasonable facsimile, was granted in the form of a simple awareness.

Up to this point in the step work, I had some difficulty knowing how my actions and choices had a direct bearing on other people's lives. This new awareness has been lasting, but not perfect.

For example, when I began my Twelfth Step obligations, I focussed a great deal of time and energy into Sponsorhip - almost to the point of neglecting some important family matters. This lack of proportion of time management was brought to my attention by my wife, and a spot inventory (10th step) revealed that I had an immediate ammend to perform and a revision of my duties.

Yes, this sixth sense (or awareness) has become vital to striking a balance between my AA and home lives.

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by avaneesh912 » Thu May 27, 2010 7:02 am

What we really have is a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition.
Yesterday a guy was sharing that he heard a speaker talking about her experience that after 27 years in sobriety suddenly started to obsess over alcohol and thank GOD she got back on AA beam working the steps again. And that he went over to her and thanked her for her honesty and told her that its a daily reprieve. He was sounding as though we have no respite from this disease..

There are other statements i hear in meetings that quizes me. Progress not Perfection, We know only little....Easy does it.....
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Lali » Thu May 27, 2010 2:04 pm

Avaneesh wrote:
“... he went over to her and thanked her for her honesty and told her that its a daily reprieve. He was sounding as though we have no respite from this disease.”


The BB says, in Chapter 5, "What we really have is a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition". Is what your fellow group member said wrong?

Aveneesh wrote:
"There are other statements i hear in meetings that quizes me. Progress not Perfection, We know only little....Easy does it....."


"Progress, not perfection" is in Chapter 6 of the BB. Actually, it states: " We claim spiritual progress rather than spiritual perfection". Is this not a valid statement?

As for "Easy Does It", I have seen this on bumper stickers for over 30 years. You can always tell if someone is "one of us", if they have that on their bumper sticker. :D
Step 1: I can't
Step 2: He can
Step 3: I think I'll let him

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Mike O » Thu May 27, 2010 2:31 pm

I have to say I share Lisars confusion as to why you feel these things are not valid, Nari.

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by avaneesh912 » Thu May 27, 2010 3:39 pm

I get a feeling that these are taken totally out of context. Thats all. Its a daily reprieve but book goes on to say its upon contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition. Why don't we stress that?
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Blue Moon » Fri May 28, 2010 10:29 am

avaneesh912 wrote:I get a feeling that these are taken totally out of context. Thats all. Its a daily reprieve but book goes on to say its upon contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition. Why don't we stress that?
I think a lot can be taken out of context.... "The Promises" spring to mind.
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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by LetgoJoe » Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:11 pm

And thank God for the total group consciousness in meetings when things are taken out of context. Some people that have been around awhile and studying the big book for awhile know when this stuff is heard and is out of context. We are able to pass on that knowledge in the ESH fashion. One I hear people say that gets screwed up is, "alcohol is but a symptom." I see more people, including myself at a time, take that and run it into a confusing thing about how I could fix my problems and then the alcohol was no longer a problem. Someone came straight out and said this in a meeting just the other day. He was identifying himself as an alcoholic and now he suddenly wasn't. After I heard that I shared and it was a bit lengthy due to it being a beginners meeting and I went back to the doctor's opinion about alcoholism and steps 1, 2 and 3 and how those had to be firmly in place before I was ready to deal with the idea of alcohol being a symptom.

Pg 63-64 BB, "Next we launched out on a course of vigorous action, the first step of which is a personal housecleaning, which many of us had never attempted. Though our decision was a vital and crucial step, it could have little permanent effect unless at once followed by a strenuous effort to face, and to be rid of, the things in ourselves which had been blocking us. Our liquor was but a symptom. So we had to get down to causes and conditions."

See, these fellas in a rehab apparently got together and decided they would talk about the idea that if they took care of their selfish nature and "grew up" they could drink successfully - responsibly. I thought, OK, just share my own ESH about how that worked out for me - horribly. Nope it took me right back to getting steps 1,2 and 3 in place before messing with that and they have to stay in place. Those steps are like the footers in the foundation without them it will all fall. I can't control their choices about what I am sharing in that regard but it sure was affirming about what I know to be the facts for me that work in keeping it simple and Honest.

I CANNOT be a good person or get along with myself or others when I drink. Drinking kills me mentally, physically and spiritually. I am incapable of dealing with any causes and conditions when I drink because I am an alcoholic. That will never change as long as I am alive and no matter what steps I work - if I drink I die. They were angry, popped up out of their chairs announcing that they were leaving and we continued on with the meeting. That seemed to be one of those tastes of the forced rehab attendance negative issues playing out. It can be draining to a degree so I stay with what works. I share with those that aren't in denial and are working this AA program, my sponsor and close friends in the fellowship. I come here and read the message and study it and share. It all works out and I keep in touch with the spiritual axiom and praying to God about that. I guess sometimes this 12 step stuff has its bittersweet moments. I am still listening and trying to stay teachable. ~Joe K.
Honesty gets us sober, tolerance keeps us sober. ~Bill W.

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Patsy© » Sun Jun 06, 2010 3:29 pm

See, these fellas in a rehab apparently got together and decided they would talk about the idea that if they took care of their selfish nature and "grew up" they could drink successfully - responsibly.
They were angry, popped up out of their chairs announcing that they were leaving and we continued on with the meeting.
I guess sometimes this 12 step stuff has its bittersweet moments. I am still listening and trying to stay teachable. ~Joe K.
Hi Joe,

Our 12 step work never has bittersweet moments, we do not share with other alcoholics to get them sober, we share with them so that we ourselves may stay sober. So Joe, your working the 12th step with them, worked beautifully.....YOU got to walk away sober, whether they did or not.

If they were angry and left because you shared the truth with them, well Joe, its been my experience that alcohol will bring them right back every single time. Seeing the truth of our selfish and self-centeredness comes when we complete our inventory in Step Four. So if we don't have Step one, then we certainly can't get to Step four.
They obviously had reservations about whether they are really alcoholic or not, and thats ok, the Big Book tells us on page 31 and 32 below, exactly how to deal with that.

We do not like to pronounce any individual as alcoholic, but you can quickly diagnose yourself. Step over to the nearest barroom and try some controlled drinking. Try to drink and stop abruptly. Try it more than once. It will not take long for you to decide, if you are honest with yourself about it. It may be worth a bad case of jitters if you get a full knowledge of your condition.
Failed 12 Step Call? Not if we walk away sober!

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by jak » Sun Jun 06, 2010 3:53 pm

Our 12 step work never has bittersweet moments...
Mine do.

jim k

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Patsy© » Sun Jun 06, 2010 4:08 pm

jak wrote:
Our 12 step work never has bittersweet moments...
Mine do.

jim k
Now why doesn't that surprise me? lol
Failed 12 Step Call? Not if we walk away sober!

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by jak » Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:31 pm

That seems rude.nlaa (not laughing at all)

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Patsy© » Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:26 am

jak wrote:That seems rude.nlaa (not laughing at all)

jim k
I apologize to you jak, in looking at it does seem rude, and that was certainly not my intention.

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by ann2 » Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:28 am

Thanks for your apology, Patsy, I hope you know it means a lot to everyone here in the forums.

One formula I have taught myself is to state my opinion ONCE. I know here in the forums that no matter what someone else says, I don't have to repeat what I said before because . . . whatever I wrote is still there!

In addition, I am never going to convince someone else. I can just share in the hope of helping others.

And I'm not going to get ANYONE to throw up their hands and proclaim my incredible understanding and superiority. Not any alcoholics at any rate :-) well nobody, unless I offer some money perhaps.

Not getting personal is another fine way to avoid problems.

Ann, just another slob on the bus in Estonia
"If I don't take twenty walks, Billy Beane send me to Mexico" -- Miguel Tejada

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Re: 11/10/08 BB Into Action P 85 (carrying the vision)

Post by Patsy© » Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:36 am

ann2 wrote:Thanks for your apology, Patsy, I hope you know it means a lot to everyone here in the forums.

One formula I have taught myself is to state my opinion ONCE. I know here in the forums that no matter what someone else says, I don't have to repeat what I said before because . . . whatever I wrote is still there!

In addition, I am never going to convince someone else. I can just share in the hope of helping others.

And I'm not going to get ANYONE to throw up their hands and proclaim my incredible understanding and superiority. Not any alcoholics at any rate :-) well nobody, unless I offer some money perhaps.

Not getting personal is another fine way to avoid problems.

Ann, just another slob on the bus in Estonia

Hi Ann,

I'm trying not to seem rude, but I am completely lost with your post.
Failed 12 Step Call? Not if we walk away sober!

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