Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoholic

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Jenniferdrew1206
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Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoholic

Post by Jenniferdrew1206 » Sat Aug 06, 2016 11:31 pm

Hi, I recently lost a good friend because she wanted me to pick up her adult , over 20, daughter on the way to a strict guideline BBSS meeting that is a Closed group, I said No, she is not an alcoholic, she identifies herself as an non alcoholic who is there to give support in meetings , to stop from being late I said yes I'll get her but I'm not on board with it. I asked the woman if even though she has never drank or drugged for that matter, does she feel like she may be alcoholic, she got rude, said I'm inappropriate for even asking , her mother, my good friend and her daughter both are now not speaking to me and claiming I have one hell of a nerve , that I'm a judger and who do I think I am asking if a someone feels alcoholic.
Just wondering, I've never cone across the never had a drink person calling themself an alcoholic and having a right to closed AA . She only wanted to come because she was bored , she usually just drops her mother off and picks her up after... Any thoughts
I'm aware of traditions..group conscience and central service... No one had a real experience to base that answer on
Thanks to those who answer
Jenn

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ann2
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by ann2 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:02 am

Hi,

I've actually heard about this before -- people going to AA, even closed meetings, without being (as yet) self-diagnosed alcoholic. I think it was okay even if weird. AA is inclusive and I've heard of many instances (even been a part of meetings) where people show up who don't "belong". I can think of possible problems but I think with your awareness to inform the group and the direction of the group conscience the problems could be dealt with.

Ann
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avaneesh912
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by avaneesh912 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 4:36 am

I took my 17 year old daughter because she has all the character traits. But she couldn't relate to what is going on in the meetings. I took her to a open, beginners meeting for 3 weeks. I told me my wife, I am not going to do that anymore. If she wants it down the road, she knows where to go. In your case its tricky. Its your friend. You could have said, you will be probably willing to take her to a open discussion meeting. What I am going to is closed. I would not pay too much about what others think. This world is full of opinion. See whats going on in the elections in the US. What a joke. One calling the other un-fit.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)

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Brock
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by Brock » Sun Aug 07, 2016 5:37 am

...are now not speaking to me and claiming I have one hell of a nerve , that I'm a judger and who do I think I am asking if a someone feels alcoholic.
Welcome here Jennifer. Earlier this week we had a conversation here about very young people attending AA as members, some were saying kids as young as eight can be alcoholics. I was in complete disagreement with kids being allowed to do this, so you can imagine how I feel about someone who never drank in our meetings.

Also this business of judging is a very 'ticklish' issue, most say we have no right to judge anyone, the only requirement is a desire to stop drinking and so forth. People conveniently overlook the long form of the tradition which starts - “Our membership ought to include all who suffer from alcoholism.” The book takes great pains to identify who suffers from alcoholism, and who is just a heavy drinker. The only reason they would do this, is to attempt to keep those who don't need the solution the program offers from showing up, because they pollute our message by saying the steps and God aren't necessary.

It seems to be almost fashionable to be attending a support group these days, what with everyone insisting on an 'emotional support dog' and other paraphernalia, keep on judging where you see fit, our program founders will thank you at the big meeting in the sky.
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by emeraldg » Sun Aug 07, 2016 6:48 am

Brock wrote:
...are now not speaking to me and claiming I have one hell of a nerve , that I'm a judger and who do I think I am asking if a someone feels alcoholic.
Welcome here Jennifer. Earlier this week we had a conversation here about very young people attending AA as members, some were saying kids as young as eight can be alcoholics. I was in complete disagreement with kids being allowed to do this, so you can imagine how I feel about someone who never drank in our meetings.

Also this business of judging is a very 'ticklish' issue, most say we have no right to judge anyone, the only requirement is a desire to stop drinking and so forth. People conveniently overlook the long form of the tradition which starts - “Our membership ought to include all who suffer from alcoholism.” The book takes great pains to identify who suffers from alcoholism, and who is just a heavy drinker. The only reason they would do this, is to attempt to keep those who don't need the solution the program offers from showing up, because they pollute our message by saying the steps and God aren't necessary.

It seems to be almost fashionable to be attending a support group these days, what with everyone insisting on an 'emotional support dog' and other paraphernalia, keep on judging where you see fit, our program founders will thank you at the big meeting in the sky.
Brock, you carry a wonderful message. Folks like Brock are the ones I want and need to stick with these days. Thanks friend.

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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by cdogg556 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 7:54 am

Brock wrote:
...are now not speaking to me and claiming I have one hell of a nerve , that I'm a judger and who do I think I am asking if a someone feels alcoholic.
Welcome here Jennifer. Earlier this week we had a conversation here about very young people attending AA as members, some were saying kids as young as eight can be alcoholics. I was in complete disagreement with kids being allowed to do this, so you can imagine how I feel about someone who never drank in our meetings.

Also this business of judging is a very 'ticklish' issue, most say we have no right to judge anyone, the only requirement is a desire to stop drinking and so forth. People conveniently overlook the long form of the tradition which starts - “Our membership ought to include all who suffer from alcoholism.” The book takes great pains to identify who suffers from alcoholism, and who is just a heavy drinker. The only reason they would do this, is to attempt to keep those who don't need the solution the program offers from showing up, because they pollute our message by saying the steps and God aren't necessary.

It seems to be almost fashionable to be attending a support group these days, what with everyone insisting on an 'emotional support dog' and other paraphernalia, keep on judging where you see fit, our program founders will thank you at the big meeting in the sky.
I also agree with you Brock, very well said!
"If you want something different, do something you've never done"

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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by PuppyEars » Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:43 am

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Last edited by PuppyEars on Tue Oct 11, 2016 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by emeraldg » Sun Aug 07, 2016 9:18 am

I will also add to what Brock said....I have experienced this only twice in closed discussions where both women fully admitted they had never had a drinking problem/were alcoholic, yet were taking on sponsees and refusing to share their own stories about their struggles with alcoholism, because their stories didn't exist. They would pressure new sponsees to do their inventories with them to gossip about their personal issues. I had often wondered why on earth they were there- but I think sometimes people are very lonely, need to feel superior to others and do not have the best of intentions.

Thankfully....it seems to be a very rare phenomenon.

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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by ezdzit247 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:16 pm

Hi Jenn

No, someone who never ever drank can not honestly claim to be "alcoholic". Alcoholism is the same thing as AUD, i.e. the acronym for what medical professionals refer to as "alcohol use disorder". Someone who has never used or abused alcohol would not qualify for treatment of this disorder. There are several other 12 Step group programs which use the Steps to recover from mental, emotional issues and/or personality disorders like Emotions Anonymous, Neurotics Anonymous, etc which many AA members have also joined for help in dealing with dry drunk syndrome. If your friend's daughter's motive for going to AA meetings is to learn how to support alcoholics in recovery, she can learn how to do that by going to Alanon meetings.
I asked the woman if even though she has never drank or drugged for that matter, does she feel like she may be alcoholic, she got rude, said I'm inappropriate for even asking....
The question you asked your friend's daughter was not inappropriate in any way. Closed AA meetings are closed to self-identified alcoholics only to protect and preserve both newcomer's and other AA members' anonymity. If this woman doesn't have a drinking problem, she would be welcome to sit and listen as a visitor at open meetings but never at closed meetings.

....her mother, my good friend and her daughter both are now not speaking to me....


Most of the "friends" I had during my drinking days and early on in sobriety eventually kind of drifted away the longer I stayed sober. There was no drama or confrontations; we just drifted apart. The loss of some of these relationships was very painful to me and letting go of them was very hard. In early sobriety, I heard a female AA speaker named Angie share that in sobriety she had found that when God's purpose for a relationship had been fulfilled, the relationship ended and it's time to move on. That made a lot of sense to me. It helped me to gain more acceptance of life on life's terms which has always been a problem area for me.

Keep coming back....
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by BillA » Sat Oct 08, 2016 4:14 pm

i am Bill A alcoholic and drug addict non AA'ers
shouldnt be in closed mtgs justout of respect.Also i know i would not have arrived in AA if 1)i didnt want to,
2)if i had not some bottom for me.I believe that i was a drunk from bith and survived to get here.
family members need to go to alanon my kids 4 daughters so have chosen to either not drink recognizing our families lenghty genetic heritage as well as severe depression to seek help were they most need it.
Short answer i cannot make any do anything they don't want to .and other than minors with dangerous psych problems ,they are generally in in charge.i feel AA fixes drunks like me only because i ask you for help

Noels

Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by Noels » Mon Oct 10, 2016 6:50 am

:D halllooooo :D wow that lady must have a seriously boring life or major mental disorder if she chooses to go to AA meetings without being an alcoholic :lol: strange indeed. If its stories she's after you should suggest she rather attend the NA meetings. Their stories are way more colourful than AA stories. Apart from that id leave her be. Perhaps she is indeed an alcoholic but do not wish to admit it yet?
Love and light
Noels xxx

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Tosh
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by Tosh » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:09 am

avaneesh912 wrote:I took my 17 year old daughter because she has all the character traits.
Was she okay with that?

You do know that just about every teenager is pathologically selfish and self-centred, don't you? And all humans are restless, irritable and discontented; we have evolved to be this way. Mother Nature does not favour happy animals who just lounge about all day; She wants us out there, looking for food and better caves.

Mother Nature doesn't care about our happiness, all She's interested in is getting grandkids.

What I'm saying is, if your daughter has all the normal extreme range of teenage emotions and reactions, she's perfectly normal and won't need A.A..

Unless of course she finds herself drinking and being unable to moderate or stop, and has a desire to do so.
Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come.” Rumi (No sniggering from the sex addicts)

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Tosh
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by Tosh » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:17 am

Jenniferdrew1206 wrote:She only wanted to come because she was bored , she usually just drops her mother off and picks her up after... Any thoughts
I'm aware of traditions..
My neighbor is an alcoholic, but he's not interested in stopping drinking. I used to take him to meetings and he was only interested in the women there.

The last time I took him to a meeting, he said he was only going because he had nothing better to do, and that he wasn't an alcoholic anymore because he could control his drinking.

I pointed out that A.A. was for someone who had a desire to stop drinking, it wasn't a form of ghoulish entertainment, and at some later stage if he had a desire to stop drinking, to give me a shout, and I'd go to any lengths to help him.

I've never taken him to a meeting since and he hasn't asked.
Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come.” Rumi (No sniggering from the sex addicts)

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NicMarie
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by NicMarie » Fri Oct 21, 2016 8:32 am

I have never been to a closed meeting.
However I did have one incident that made going to a meeting very nerve wrecking for a while.

I was in my first month of sobriety and had had the worst morning. Lost my keys, spilled my coffee, was late for a lecture, my son was being a pain... the whole nine yards. I white knuckled it to my favorite New Comers meeting, fell into that awful orange fuzzy chair and thanked my HP for the strangers surrounding me. Half way through I was being eyeballed by a wonderful woman, urging me to speak. So I did. I was not even one sentence in before I started crying because I was covered in coffee, crying in an AA meeting. (lol)
After my two minute rant I took a breath and felt such relief. The older man next to me squeezed my shoulder and told me I was doing good.

Then a man introduced himself. He was gruff and obviously annoyed. Soon he was going on about how the meetings have lost all their sanctity and tradition. He lamented that stupid things like losing your keys or traffic will happen and one just needs to get over it, that a real alcoholic knows what real pain and lack of serenity feels and the younger generation Expletive too much. He said something about these meetings being for people who have spent their whole lives under the bottle.

Now, I know this is not true. I know that man was fighting his own battle and needed someone to yell at or belittle. I know that NOW. I did not know that then and I spent the next week afraid to speak about my silly worries, triggers or upsets. I knew that I had the desire to stop dinking but he had me questioning my 'alcoholic status'. After all I had only been an active drinker for 5 years. I know now that that gentleman needed a closed meeting and maybe a call with his sponsor.

But for a short time that disruption of acceptance created an environment that was anything but supportive.

I guess what I am trying to say is what happens in a meeting can and will impact at least a few people and we need to remember that AA meetings are a place of vulnerability, brutal honesty that requires serenity and respect among those who attend. This will no always be the case of course, tempers run high and people disagree. At the end of the day we must ask ourselves if we are bringing to the meeting what we want others to bring. This applies to everything from negativity to people.
"Happiness can be found in even the darkest of times, if one simply knows to turn on the light" -Albus P.W.B. Dumbledore

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avaneesh912
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Re: Can someone who never ever drank claim they are an alcoh

Post by avaneesh912 » Fri Oct 21, 2016 10:31 am

nless of course she finds herself drinking and being unable to moderate or stop, and has a desire to do so.
I did it just so she is comfortable to use the rooms after I am gone. Also had to oblige the mom. Its all bondage. No wonder the seers left the home, so they can be dis-entangled from family bondage.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)

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