I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor...

Most of us who recovered with AA's program did so with the help of a "sponsor". But what is sponsorship? How do I get one? Who can be a sponsor? What makes a good sponsor?
Patsy©
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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Patsy© » Sat Jul 13, 2013 6:56 am

Hi Ann....I am glad that it gave you a smile :D
Failed 12 Step Call? Not if we walk away sober!

Service
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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Service » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:01 pm

The A.A Big Book has a different idea other than governmENTALL people needing guidance
"Burn the idea into the consciousness of every man: he can get well regardless of anyone. The only condition is that he trust in God and clean house."
Why do people insist on promoting themselves? it's surly beyond alcoholism !!

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ann2
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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by ann2 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 11:58 pm

Hi Service,

It's interesting -- in another online meeting I am in there was recently a discussion about growing away from sponsors, and accepting sponsors' defects as one recovers through the program. Basically, I am with the descriptions offered in the pamphlet about sponsorship AA has on its main site, aa.org, and what is suggested in the booklet Living Sober -- after taking the steps, and experiencing a spiritual awakening, my need for a sponsor changed. My sponsor sensed that, as I was blessed with excellent guidance in choosing her :) .

However, there was a lady who I asked for help in hearing my 5th step who later made my life hell with her interactions with me. It was a wonderful growing experience but I am glad I never asked her to sponsor me. I think she might have wanted me to, but it didn't seem right.

I have always felt safer with the Group, and being involved with more than just a few alcoholics. Perhaps it is a lack of energy in a group's 12th step outreach that creates a gap for individuals to step in and try to provide more than a sponsor really should. Groups need EVERYONE, all its members, contributing, speaking up, interfering :)

Alcoholics are sensitive, yes, but we are also lazy. And cheap, besides. But that's another thread.

Ann
"If I don't take twenty walks, Billy Beane send me to Mexico" -- Miguel Tejada

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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Service » Wed Jul 17, 2013 11:37 am

Why all this psychobabble games? - A.A has only 3 penitent simple ideas either you agree with A.A's spirit or continue on with justifying the outside sponsorship system in your life that runs off health people .

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Tosh
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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Tosh » Wed Jul 17, 2013 12:30 pm

Service wrote:Why all this psychobabble games? - A.A has only 3 penitent simple ideas either you agree with A.A's spirit or continue on with justifying the outside sponsorship system in your life that runs off health people .
Weird. The guy who mainly authored the Big Book had a sponsor and sponsored. If you think God just magicks us better you've misunderstood something. It kinda reminds me of something I've read here; "If you've got diarrhoea and you pray to God to fix it, you'll end up with a shitty arse!" And my concept of God may very well include humans; it may include everything. Ah, 'no human power' you may argue, but you'd have to define what you mean by 'human power' first.

Still, if I'm here to share my experience, my sponsor sponsors me in accordance with Chapter 7 of the Big Book. He just laid the spiritual tool kit at my feet; it's my choice whether to pick it up or not. I now try to carry this message to other alcoholics in the same manner; I force nothing on no-one - it just wouldn't work that way - and let's not forget...

Chapter 7
"PRACTICAL EXPERIENCE shows that nothing will so much insure immunity from drinking as intensive work with other alcoholics."
So here it doesn't say 'God magics us immune from alcohol', it says "INTENSIVE WORK WITH OTHER ALCOHOLICS" immune us from alcohol. No human power eh? I like what the Suffi's (Muslim mystics) say about God. They say when God created man, He put a spark of himself inside each one of us.

Big Book:
God is everything
and that means you, me, Mrs Tosh, the population of Lithuania - everything. When I've experienced God - and I believe it is an experience - other people have always been involved. Step 5, Step 9, Step 12; all these spiritual experiences involved other humans.

You're welcome to your views, Service, and I look forward to your reply.
Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come.” Rumi (No sniggering from the sex addicts)

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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Service » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:44 pm

"PRACTICAL EXPERIENCE shows that nothing will so much insure immunity from drinking as intensive work with other alcoholics."
Let’s try not to take this quote out of context, as the outside sponsorship system tries to rationalize itself. The Big BOOK is referring to people not here yet, with out a way out, not referring to menacing into other peoples life’s. And yes God is everything OR He IS NOTHING why make him nothing? Because ye who has so little faith? Being sober one should be able to understand,unless there are those who have emotional and mental disorders and even they can get sober but again we should not confuse it with A.A’s message not yours or mine but A.A’S –Try reading the book in the first person and more will be reviled, better yet read the traditions in the first person you will be amazed before you are half way through !!

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Tosh
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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Tosh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:51 pm

Service wrote: not referring to menacing into other peoples life’s.
I think we're discussing two different concepts of sponsorship here. My concept of sponsorship is intensive work, with the Big Book, with another alcoholic. It's got nothing to do with 'menacing into other people's lives'. The Big Book says I should 'carry this message' and 'lay the spiritual tool kit down at their feet', not force anything - or menace anyone.
Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come.” Rumi (No sniggering from the sex addicts)

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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Service » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:22 pm

Tosh
I think we're discussing two different concepts of sponsorship here
Why do you intensely fear that if you don't administer whatever to someone ALREADY HERE you may get drunk? What's wrong with helping people not here and show them a way out instead

Weird. The guy who mainly authored the Big Book had a sponsor and sponsored
Bil W never sponsored Dr Bob WHY ? Dr Bob Never sponsored Bill W Why they were already here Ebby sponsored Bill to the hospital not A.A - Ebby died a drunk and was never a member of A.A - Take a closer look either God could and would if sought OR LIVE GOVERmental with an outside sponsored religious system - simple as that


Why all this psychobabble games? - A.A has only 3 penitent simple ideas either you agree with A.A's spirit or continue on with justifying the outside system in your life that runs off health people .

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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by kenyal » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:34 pm

I think I may finally understand. You've been relying on Google Translate to convert your thoughts into our language. I get the same mess going from English to Danish.

In saying "Why do you intensely fear that if you don't administer whatever to someone ALREADY HERE you may get drunk?" you mean that Tosh wants to give something to someone someplace because he is afraid and might drink.

"What's wrong with helping people not here and show them a way out instead" means that by helping people we can't see or contact, they will be shown a way out of the spot where they not actually are.

"Dr Bob Never sponsored Bill W Why they were already here" So, by being both already here that eliminated any possibility that Bill could carry this message to Bob.

"Ebby sponsored Bill to the hospital not A.A - Ebby died a drunk and was never a member of A.A" So, Ebby could not have helped Bill to stop drinking because he was not an AA member at the time and also because he later drank again.

"...either God could and would if sought OR LIVE GOVERmental with an outside sponsored religious system - simple as that" Maybe for you...this one eludes me completely. I can't see how to connect the actions of a live government and a religious system that is from the outside, yet is sponsored in some way by somebody.

"Why all this psychobabble games?" I'm going to blame all the babble on Google Translate.

"A.A has only 3 penitent simple ideas either you agree with A.A's spirit or continue on with justifying the outside system in your life that runs off health people." Pretty sure you meant pertinent and propose a choice between agreeing with you or continuing to support sponsorship as it has commonly been done in AA since the earliest days of the program.

Pretty close?

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Re: I've had a slight difference of opinion with my sponsor.

Post by Service » Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:36 am

Some interested in just words others interested in the meaning hope you don't take it as mean if you know what I mean !

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